This blog originally founded by Blogger who holds a theological degree and a doctorate in Counseling Psychology. Taught Psychology for 32 years and is now Professor Emeritus. Is a board-certified psychologist and was awarded the Lifetime Achievement Award in his profession. Ministered as a chaplain, and pastored Baptist and Episcopal churches. Publications cover the integration of psychology and theology. Served in the Army, the Merchant Marines and the Peace Corps.

Wednesday, September 12, 2012

Watauga School Board NOT COLLECTING TUITION OWED!

We have previously discussed the fact that the Watauga County School Board, for whatever reason, has not been enforcing the requirement for out of county students attending Watauga County Schools, to pay for there tuition. Watauga taxpayers have been subsidizing the education of children from other counties by allowing them to attend our schools instead of the ones in their own county. There are SOMETIMES good reason for this....Blowing Rock residents who live across the county line would have to travel excessive distances to attend a Caldwell school for example.  So, YES it's fine in some cases for them to attend Watauga Schools....but Watauga taxpayers shouldn't foot the bill!

Jesse Wood of the High Country Press is now reporting that only 11% of out-of-county students are actually being billed for attending our schools! (See Article Here)

I expect that it's probably just easier for the School Board members to just ask the county for more money than it is to actually enforce the rules and collect what is due us from out of county students.
A GOOD REASON TO VOTE IN A NEW SCHOOL BOARD!

It will be interesting to watch what efforts are made to collect the PAST DUE amounts as well as enforce these requirements in the future!

66 comments:

Anonymous said...

Let the school board pay out of their own pockets! They should be sued for their malfeasance!

Anonymous said...

I am thinking that the more students we can get into Watauga schools, the more teachers we can justify hiring.

Anonymous said...

Some history: the board as it is currently made up only approved 9 percent of the total number of out of county students that are currently enrolled. The other 91 percent of out county students that were allowed to attend without tuition were approved under school board chair Lowell Younce. It was this current board that took up this issue and is working to deal with the mess left by him. And while you are critizing how about praising John Welch for standing up to the hike in parking fees. He had a cost reducing, common sense suggestion that the rest of board either wasn't smart enough to understand or didn't care about. It also would not surprise me if it was Mr. Welch that decided to look at the tuition problem as well.

NewGuy said...

The policy was put in place by the prior school board. Yount left the school board in 2010. And your saying "it wouldn't surprise me if...." is just another way of saying you don't know and aren't willing to check out your facts. Sort of like it wouldn't surprise me if you still beat your wife!

I hold the Republicans on the board equally accountable as the Dems...I never made any political distinctions about this at all. But, since you brought it up, Welch has been on this board for almost 2 years now. If this is how he handles BOE money, I sure don't want him as attempting to handle the county's money as a member of the Board of Commissioners. But thanks for making that point for me!

Anonymous said...

anon 4:01 I would like to know what happened with parking fees and how did this save the taxpayers any money? Thanks.

Mike D. said...

Blogger,

Would you please consider deleting the comments of contributors who attempt to expose the identity of contributors who post under a nickname? It is a petty, thuggish form of intimidation, and it has nothing to do with the subject matter of discussions.

guy faulkes said...

New Guy is correct about this issue. The blame goes to those that earned it. These are the past and present members of the board that have allowed it to happen, regardless of party.

The problems have been discussed and could certainly have been fixed in two years.

Anonymous said...

I'd be interested to hear Deborah Greene's thoughts on this issue as well as what she would do should she be elected in November.

Anonymous said...

I'm sure she would be glad to tell you....over, and over, and over, and over, and over and.........


Call her and ask her.

guy faulkes said...

If I am not mistaken, Deborah already talked about this issue some time ago.

If I remember correctly, she was strongly in favor of collecting monies for out of county students. I believe this included Blowing Rock, which is partially in Caldwell County. If this is not the case, it should be, because the school is in Watauga. Also, if I remember correctly the fees are collected between the counties, not between the parents and the county.

Mike D. said...

I would be very interested in Deborah "Taliban" Greene keeping her aggressive theocracy to herself. Her interest is not to protect our Constitution, but to follow the marching orders her religion gives her, even when it conflicts with the law of the land... my land, my country. That woman should not be allowed anywhere near a position of power, as she has already declared her intention to ignore the rules of our Constitution where they differ from her religious views.

It doesn't matter what Debbie "Taliban" knows. What matters is what she would do if given power. She is a frightening individual.

Anonymous said...

Mike D. How is Deborah Greene a frightening individual?

What did she specifically do that caused you to think she would not obey the true, de jure Constitution?

Please answer.

guy faulkes said...

Well, MIkeD, vote against her if you feel this way. I guess we will cancel each other's vote.

This is the interesting thing about a democratic republic.

ITCM said...

I know of myself + at least 7 family members and friends who will not be voting for Deborah Greene. As I said months ago, I'm going to do everything I can to not let her win this or any election.

NewGuy said...

Just curious ITCM, will you be voting for the 3 Democrat candidates? And, would you be voting the same way whether she (Greene) was in the race or not?

Mike D. said...

Anonymous,

I would love to answer your question, so please choose a name to use in this forum and re-post your question. Thanks!

ITCM said...

No, I will vote for school board based on their response to the questionnaire. I am Independent, so I don't just vote Democrat because of the name or ideology.

NewGuy said...

Thanks, ITCM. Would you share with us the qualities you believe you would be looking for in a BOE member? I am hoping for some management experience on the board...and some sense of fiscal responsibility. I have watched the present board act as a lobbyist for the teachers and not as advocates for the students!

Their ignoring their own rules on collecting out of county tuitions while, at the same time, lobbying Watauga County Commission for more taxpayer support gives me all the reason I need to not vote for any of the existing board members ever again.

Republican OR Democrat!

Anonymous said...

Mike D. Of course, an obvious diversion instead of answering the questions.

Other posters use the designation 'anonymous', and it is a choice.

So please, again, answer how Deborah Greene is a frightening individual, and what did she do that causes you to think she would not honor the Constitution?

Deborah Greene said...

I have some comments. First, the parking fee situation was brought to the attention of the current board via a letter I sent to Dr. Kafitz. I have requested the public records necessary to perform an audit on the fees collected at WHS. When I am done, I will print my full report.

What I do know is this:

1) The fees were collected prior to the board approval and the law gives, the board only, the authority to establish parking fees. The board retroactively approved the fee schedule, calling it an oversight. It was malfeasance; not oversight. I call it malfeasance because this board has been continually failing to do its duties.
2) The parking fees were being collected by a non-school employee; they were being collected by Mountain Alliance. It has not been confirmed; however, it has been suggested that Mountain Alliance receives a portion of these fees. (The school board denied the funding of Mountain Alliance. I was at the meeting when Mountain Alliance made their pitch to the "finance committee" and had their funding denied. I understand the circumstances which is another story in itself.)
3) Parking fines are another issue that the board has yet to address. The law provides that the most that can be charged is $10; they are charging as much as $15. Again the fines are being collected by Mountain Alliance.
5) My letter also brought to the board's attention that they did not have a contract with Mountain Alliance.
4) I will post my entire email letter to Dr. Kafitz and his response. This will sum up the situation. And, give everyone an idea of the unwillingness to answer questions. Please note that they are not required to answer questions. The law specifically says they do not fall under "public records request". However, one would question, why they would not volunteer to answer the question. We can only assume the answer is not a good one.

I had told New Guy that I wouldn't comment on this cite and he said good, stay off of it. However, I have been asked.

Deborah Greene said...

PART II

I also have some questions about the students that don't live here and the fees collected or not collected. I am not willing to comment until I have done my homework. Some questions to consider:

1) How many illegal aliens do we school in this county?
2) What special resources do we have to commit to the education of the illegal aliens?

I feel every child should be educated. Our federal government has not addressed the situation. So, as long as illegal aliens reside here, it is in our best interest to give these children an education. So, my point is to say, how much is the education of illegal aliens costing us in comparison to children on the other side of the border of our county?

We must keep in mind that every county has border issues with neighboring counties. You take Blowing Rock, I am sure that, out of necessity to Caldwell County- distance to schools from home, children are being sent to to Blowing Rock. The same could be said of those in Tennessee.

I don't think that children of Watauga teachers should be given any special privilege; their hardship is the same as the hardship of others who work in Watauga County.

Another question to ask, are these children counted in the figures given to the State for enrollment? Is the State determining the number of teachers we can have based on these children? Are those teachers not being funded by the State? What is the true impact of not charging? Is it just a loss of revenue that can be charged?

I don't trust numbers from a board that produces an audited financial statement that overstates assets by $25 million.

Bottom line: We have an inconsistent/unfair policy. The same exists with parents who want to send their children to different schools within the county due to hardships situations. Some just want to do it because they think one school is better than the other; or, they want their children to hob knob with only certain children. And, again, those of influence or connections get their way.

I will comment more when I have my facts. Problem we have; the closed sessions on these decisions are protected. I think we should be able to have these records with the parent and children names "blacked out".

NewGuy said...

"I had told New Guy that I wouldn't comment on this cite and he said good, stay off of it."

Deborah, that is just not true!

NewGuy said...

Deborah...I don't know where you come up with the things that you do, but once you have them in your mind, you repeat them as "facts".

You and I have never had a conversation, on line or off line, about your posting on this blog. You never told me that you wouldn't post here anymore and I obviously didn't respond to a statement not made. I specifically never said "Good. stay off of it!".

I don't know why you would make false statements like this, but I suppose you must do so for a reason.

ITCM said...

Deborah Greene, remember when you said this? "And, to the many that were hoping that once I ran for an office that I would shut up, that is not going to happen! Watch dog first! We are moving on. It just not be in the direction you want us to move." Watch dog first? You mean, you aren't going to dedicate all of your energy and time towards helping Watauga's students receive the best education possible?

And how are you going to feel if you make it on the board after you have labeled them all as "tyrants"? Are they going to be willing to even work with you? I wouldn't, based on your words..."John Welch has been a big disappointment. And, Delora Hodges has been a bigger disappointment. The rest of them were a disappointment for years. They teach each other how to be tyrants...GRADE F Lets change that Lady Bird Johnson statement that Dr. Hemric quotes on his emails to this one by Inquiring Mind: "Tyrants will always live up to what you expect of them.""

Yes, Deborah Greene, you're such a helpful and fun person to have around. You truly care about our county's children, I can tell. In actuality, you are on a power trip with an ego the size of Texas.

Anonymous said...

Hey! Leave Texas out of this!

Anonymous said...

ITCM: Good--we desperately need an independent watchdog! The policies, manner, and attitude of the BOE and BOC of the last two decades, both parties, have been atrocious in their handling of county business and funds. And when citizens request public information, the officials have been uncommunicative, hostile, and have outright refused to grant these requests on many occasions.

Also, ITCM, are you saying that the same status quo, the same people who have been in charge for two decades now, have always and still are looking after the best interests of the students? I notice you did not include the 'taxpayers best interests'. Don't you think the 'taxpayers' should be in that same category of the duties of the BOE and the BOC also?

ITCM -- 'Fun' to be around is not the issue or a qualification for a conscientious, honest public official. And from the record of both boards of the last many years, we definitely need much better than the same ole corrupt spendthrift, top-heavy status quo.

Deborah Greene said...

How we forget, New Guy! Now back to the subject at hand.

PART III - Copy of email to Dr. Kafitz August 15, 2012 (Issues partially addressed at September 10, 2012 Board of Education meeting. Board approved WHS parking fees publicly so we all know; board approved memorandum of understanding with Mountain Alliance to allow them to have an office at WHS (the office that was built for ROTC); and the board established a policy committee to make sure their policies are consistent).

EMAIL TO DR. KAFITZ BEGINS HERE

>> On Wed, Aug 15, 2012 at 5:00 PM, ip401k wrote:
>>
>> August 15, 2012
>>
>>
>> David D. Kafitz, Jr., Ed.D
>> Superintendent
>> Watauga County Schools
>> KafitzD@watauga.k12.nc.us
>>
>> Re: School Fees - Paricularly WHS Parking Fees
>>
>> Dear. Dr. Kafitz:
>>
>> Thank you for taking time out of your busy school schedule to meet with me. As I stated, my meeting was in the capacity as a school board candidate. Being a candidate, I am approached by citizens regarding school issues. Last week and this week, I have been approached on 5 occasions regarding the WHS parking fees. As you have indicated this is considered "hear say" unless the citizen contacts you directly. You have perhaps concluded that I expect you to address the issue; however, my appointment was to gather information to be better informed. Once I gather the information then I will take the next appropriate step, as I deem necessary.
>>
>> During our discussion of the WHS parking fees you said: "We looked into it and we don't have to have school board approval." I understand you are new. As, I stated, the school board has a policy that requires school board approval of all fees.
>>
>> May I direct your attention to Watauga County School Policy 1.01.30, Powers and Duties of the Board: "As delegated by the North Carolina General Assembly, the board of education has, among others, the following powers and duties: 6. To regulate fees, charges, and solicitations." This policy refers to NC General Statute 115C-47 (6) "as delegated by the North Carolina General Assembly":
>>
>> "To Regulate Fees, Charges and Solicitations. - Local boards of education shall adopt rules and regulations governing solicitations of, sales of, and fund-raising activities conducted by, students and faculty members in schools under their jurisdiction, and no fees, charges, or costs shall be collected from students and school personnel without approval of the board of education as recorded in the minutes of said board; provided, this subdivision shall not apply to such textbook fees as are determined and established by the State Board of Education. All schedule of fees, charges and solicitations approved by the local boards of education shall be reported to the Superintendent of Public Instruction."
>>
>> The following is my first public records request
>>
>> 001 - 8152012 The legal source you are relying on that allows fees to be charged without school board approval.
>>
>> 002 - 8152012 The minutes of the school board where the fees for WHS parking were approved by the school board for the years beginning 7/1/2010, 7/1/2011 and 7/1/2012 (or effective during the fiscal years beginning with these dates).
>>
>> 003 - 8152012 Proof of submission of the WHS parking and other fees, charges and solicitations to the Superintendent of Public Instruction for fees effective during the fiscal years beginning 7/1/2010, 7/1/2011 and 7/1/2012.

Deborah Greene said...

Letter to Dr. Kafitz continued

May I also direct your attention to Watauga County School Policy 5.07.10, Automobile Use at Watauga High School. The "Watauga High School Parking Guidelines 2012-2013" issued to students and requiring their signature is in violation of this policy. And, this policy further places the power to set fees with the Board of Education:

"All students meeting eligibility requirements shall register license tag numbers in the office of all vehicles that may occupy the assigned parking space. All students shall pay a fee set by the Board of Education. Any additional vehicles registered will be charged $1.00. Any requests for temporary space will be charged $1.00 per day."

004 - 8152012 Please provide school board minutes showing the school board reviewed and approved the Watauga High School Parking Guidelines 2012-2013.

The power to regulate parking on public school grounds is given to the local boards of education under NC General Statute 115-46:

"(a) Any local board of education may adopt reasonable rules and regulations with respect to the parking of motor vehicles and other modes of conveyance on public school grounds and may enforce such rules and regulations. A violation of a rule or regulation concerning parking on public school grounds is an infraction punishable by a penalty of not more than ten dollars ($10.00) unless the regulation provides that the violation is not punishable as an infraction. Rules and regulations adopted hereunder shall be made available for inspection by any person upon request."

"(d) Any motor vehicle parked in a parking lot on school grounds, when such lot is clearly designated as such by a sign no smaller than 24 inches by 24 inches prominently displayed at each entrance thereto, in violations of the rules and regulations adopted by the local board of education, or any motor vehicle otherwise parked on school grounds in violation of the rules and regulations adopted by the county or city local board of education, may be removed from school grounds to a place of storage and the registered owner of that vehicle shall become liable for removal and storage charges......"

005 -08152012 Please provide a copy of all local board of education approved parking rules and regulations for inspection.

Deborah Greene said...

Letter to Dr. Kafitz continued

006 - 08152012 What is the status of such signage? (Please note removal of vehicles under the current WHS parking guidelines may result in fees payable by the Board of Education without the required signage.)

I understand from 2 sources that Mountain Alliance members were collecting the parking fees. I also understand that parking fines are collected by Mountain Alliance at the Mountain Alliance office which I understand is located in the WHS building.

007 - 08152012 Please provide a list of Mountain Alliance members that are utilizing the office at the high school and please denote the if the members are employees of the Watauga County Schools. Are all non-WHS personnel members of Mountain Alliance allowed to enter the schools at will? Has a background check been done on the members who have at will access of the schools. Which schools do these non-WCS personnel have at will access?

008 - 08152012 Please provide, for inspection, a copy of any contracts with Mountain Alliance and Watauga County Schools.

009 - 08152012 Does Mountain Alliance utilize space in WHS as an office? Do we charge for that space? How long have they utilized this space? Do we provide telephone service? Furniture? Equipment? Please provide, for inspection, an inventory list of items allocated to Mountain Alliance and any budget related information for the fiscal years beginning 7/1/2010, 7/1/2011 and 7/1/2012.

010 - 08152012 Does Mountain Alliance utilize parking spaces?

011 - 08152012 Mountain Alliance has 2 boats on WHS property. How are the boats utilized by Watauga County Schools?

012 - 08152012 Please provide for inspection all financial records related to the WHS fees for fiscal years beginning 7/1/2010, 7/1/2011 and 7/1/2012, including but not limited to bank statements, income and expense records, and financial reports.

May I direct you attention to NC General Statute -448, Special funds of individual schools: "The board of education shall appoint a treasurer for each school within the local school administrative unit that handles special funds. The treasurer shall keep a complete record of all moneys in his charge in such form and detail as may be prescribed by the finance director of the local school administrative unit, and shall make reports to the superintendent and finance officer of the local school administrative unit as they or the board of education may prescribe....."

013 - 08152012 Please provide a list of all "trustees" for all Watauga County Schools and any personnel authorized to sign checks for individual school funds. Please provide, for inspection the minutes, where the school board appointed such treasurer and date of appointment.

Deborah Greene said...

Letter to Dr. Kafitz continued:

014 - 08152012 Please provide a copy of the latest financial report for each school with individual school funds.

015 - 08152012 Please provide a copy the guidelines prescribed by the finance director to the treasurers.

016 - 08152012 Please provide a copy of the most recent bank statement for each of the individual school funds.

Also, during our discussion, you mentioned that Deborah Miller had received a call concerning the reduced fee for a parking pass for vehicles who met the "low emission" standards. I suggested that very few students would drive a car that would meet these standards. You stated that at that time you had issued 138 parking passes with 21 being at the reduced rate. When I asked you to check the list for the oldest vehicle that would qualify, you found that the oldest car was as 2005. Again, I claim that most kids cannot afford or are provided a vehicle that new. My son had to pay his own automobile insurance from day one. He could not afford anything that new. He drove a 1984 Dodge Truck and a 1996 Jeep. You also stated that the reason for giving the discount had to do with the school's LEED certification.

017 - 08152012 Please provide the link to the web address where you accessed the list of "low emission cars" and/or list or email with attachments regarding such list of cars.

Deborah Greene said...

018 - 08152012 List of parking passes issued, the fee and description of automobile.

019 - 08152012 Inventory of vehicle passes (issued, canceled, surrendered, lost, stolen, defaced, etc). The idea here is enough information for me to audit the inventory. In other words, you start with a number of passes, each numbered; and, you should be able to account for each pass. If these passes are year sensitive, please provide the inventory for the school year 2011-2012 and 2012-2012 as of 8/17/2012.

020 - 08152012 Please provide a copy of the WHS LEED certification application. I asked you if the LEED certification could be obtained without the special reduction parking pass for "low emission" cars and you were going to check into that. I would like to know what the school would lose if they were to remove the special reduction from the policy.

During our discussion you also assured me that none of the parking fees were being used to fund Mountain Alliance. Can you assure me that none of the individual school funds of WHS are going to fund Mountain Alliance? If not, which funds are being collected and used to fund Mountain Alliance?

As discussed, I was present at the final finance committee meeting where the Watauga County Schools Finance Committee was finalizing the budget to be submitted to the county commissioners. Unfortunately, none of the other school board candidates were present. At that meeting, Mountain Alliance made a presentation to the committee for funding. After the presentation, the finance committee discussed the funding and decided to not fund Mountain Alliance. The only finance committee members in favor of funding Mountain Alliance were Dr. Jones and Mr. Gasperson (Human Resource Director) at the time. (As you would say, "Am I making a statement or asking a question?" I am making a statement, for what it is worth, and not expecting a comment from you or any action for that matter.)

You also asked me a question that every superintendent at WHS has asked me, "Do I have a child in the school system?" When I told you no that I didn't have a child in the school system. You made an odd facial expression. You indicated that you didn't understand why I was getting involved. You may not be accustomed to citizen/taxpayer involvement beyond parents. However, I take pride in being involved in my government; it is a duty. I would hope that our students are being educated to be involved. Also, I am running for school board; I want to be able to fulfill the expectations of the role if I am elected. Again, as a candidate, I am approached and am making every effort to be informed.

When I asked you if you had read my letter to the Local Government Commission with regard to the deplorable condition of the school financial system and reports, you indicated that you had read my blog. I don't have a blog. I do however blog. Glad to know that you read them. However, I would request that you read the attached letter to the local government commission and review the last audit for deficiencies noted by the auditors. The deficiencies noted were brought to the school boards attention. They ignored them and I then submitted the attached summary to Sharon Edmisten of the LGC. The LGC contacted the auditors. And, responses are still pending from the LGC.

As in the past, please notify as a request can be fulfilled. And, I understand that you have the right to black out names of students.

Thank you in advance for your prompt attention to my request.

Respectfully submitted,


Deborah B. Greene
808 Castleford Rd
Boone, NC 28607
(828) 308-1803
greene3412@bellsouth.net

Deborah Greene said...

First Response from Dr. Kafitz:

On Aug 16, 2012, at 2:59 PM, "Dr. David Kafitz" wrote:

> Ms. Green,
>
> Thank you for your email formally outlining the information you desire from the Watauga County Schools Board of Education. I will be meeting shortly with the board attorney and chair to review your request. After that meeting, if there are items determined to be inappropriate for release, you will be notified via this email address.
>
> So that you are notified at this time, a $0.10 per copy fee will be charged for the production of this information. As you are aware, the board of education is allowed to charge for copies made for requests of information by the public.
>
> Your request is assumed received as of today, Thursday, August 16, 2012. The information which is determined to be eligible for release to you (see comments above regarding review of your request by the board attorney), will be prepared for you in no more than 20 business days or Friday, September 14, 2012 (we are closed on Monday, September 3, 2012 due to the Labor Day Holiday) by the close of business. If these documents are available prior to this date, you will be notified at this email address along with the total cost of copying for the records. Payment in full will be expected at the time of pickup of the records prior to their release.
>
> Should you have any questions, please feel free to reply by email.
>
> Sincerely,
>
> David Kafitz

Deborah Greene said...

Response 2 from Dr. Kafitz. Please note which questions were not answered and then ask yourself, why.

Re: School Fees-Particularly WHS Parking Fees
From:
David Kafitz
To: Deborah Greene
Cc: Paul Miller ; Deborah Miller

Dear Ms. Greene,

Thank you for your email of August 15, 2012. I have met with our board attorney, Mr. Paul Miller, and reviewed the email. Listed below by item number is the response to each.

· 001-08152012: This is not a public records request. No response required.
· 002-08152012: Copies of these specific meeting minutes will be made.
· 003-08152012: Copies of these specific documents will be made.
· 004-08152012: Copies of these specific meeting minutes will be made.
· 005-08152012: Copies of these specific meeting minutes will be made.
· 006-08152012: This is not a public records request. No response required.
· 007-08152012: This is not a public records request. No response required.
· 008-08152012: Copies of this contract will be made.
· 009-08152012: This is not a public records request. No response required.
· 010-08152012: This is not a public records request. No response required.
· 011-08152012: This is not a public records request. No response required.
· 012-08152012: These documents will be made available for inspection.
· 013-08152012: A copy of this document will be made and other documents made available for inspection as requested.
· 014-08152012: Copies of these documents will be made.
· 015-08152012: A copy of this document will be made.
· 016-08152012: Copies of these documents will be made.
· 017-08152012: A copy of this document will be made.
· 018-08152012: A copy of this information will be made.
· 019-08152012: A copy of this information will be made.
· 020-08152012: A copy of this document will be made.

When assembly of these documents is complete, you will be contacted. At that time, you will be notified of the cost to copy to be paid at the time of pickup of these records.

Sincerely,

David D. Kafitz, Jr., Ed.D.
Superintendent
Watauga County Schools

175 Pioneer Trail
P.O. Box 1790
Boone, NC 28607
828-264-7190 - Office
828-264-7196 - Fax

www.watauga.k12.nc.us

NewGuy said...


Deborah....it may be the "subject at hand" for you, but you can't just lie about something that never happened and then gloss over it. You obviously know that you and I never had the exchange you alluded to; that I never said any such thing to you and yet you post such a fabrication here? I don't understand what motivates you but it isn't the first time I have seen you make up accusations against people you apparently have some disagreement with and then repeat them as "fact". If you insist on maintaining that I said anything at all about you not posting on this "cite" (sic)..then support your allegation with a copy of the post, or at least an explanation of why you are saying such a thing. Why would you make that up? If you are simply mistaken, then at least have the decency to apologize. If you are insisting it to be true, back it up

guy faulkes said...

I remember Ms. Greene saying she would leave the site, but the way I remember it, the comment was in response to some feed back she was getting form some liberal posters, including Mike D. As I remember it, New Guy made some kind of comment about not agreeing with her on several issues, but wishing she would not leave because although her posts were verbose, they were very informative. I believe I agreed with New Guy on that post.

I could be wrong, I have slept since then.

In any case, welcome back, Ms. Greene. I enjoy reading your posts.

NewGuy said...

Guy...Obviously, if she DID say that she wasn't going to post anymore, then she didn't hold true to her word!

But, I don't remember her saying she was going to leave! I do know that I never asked her to leave and I never told her "good" or whatever she is claiming I said to her. I don't know why she wouild even make that up - I would like to believe she is just confused and mistaken and, if that is the case, would apologize.

You might recall, I actually supported her in the Primary for the school board.

guyf aulkes said...

Yes, I remember you saying you would support her, New Guy, as did I.

I am certain she did say she was leaving, but it was not because of any comments from the regular posters with the possible exception of Mike D. I really do not understand this reasoning, because of the debate is among adults, that is the most stimulating thing about the blog.

In all fairness, I did sort of invite her back on this thread and to tell the truth, would like yo see he back regularly. She posts lots of good information.

NewGuy said...

She may post SOME "good" information Guy, but it is often intermixed with her opinions and conclusions which she has no hesitation about claiming as "facts".

Here's one fact. I never communicated with her in any form asking her not to post here nor telling her that it was "good" that she didn't. She apparently gets things in her mind and they become "facts" to her.

Deborah Greene said...

My facts are backed up and my opinion is just that. And, make no mistake about it; I make a clear distinction between fact and opinion.

New Guy made the comment in front of headquarters and there was a witness. End of story. Now, I am only commenting because somebody on here said that they wanted me to and a friend conveyed the message.

The only time my facts are considered opinions under the claim of fact, is when people don't want to believe the facts!

guy faulkes said...

New Guy, what you say about Ms. Greene's use of what she considers facts is true, but then to some degree it true for everyone, It has to be, because, as that great philosopher Aaron Tippon sang, you have to stand for something or you will fall for anything.

The interesting part is sorting the opinion from the fact and when you come down to it, that is a matter of opinion in and of itself. Take for instance how HM and I can look at the same thing and see something entirely different.

When the rubber meets the road I think most of the people on here distinguish the difference very well. I hope at least some of them would say that about me.

NewGuy said...

Deborah...I gave you the benefit of the doubt when I said you were probably mistaken. Now you are alleging that we had a conversation in front of HQ about you posting on this blog?

That's not "mistaken"...that's pure fantasy!


NewGuy said...

Guy, yes ...to some degree you are correct and that we might offer a strong opinion as fact. But, are you saying it was her OPINION that she had a conversation with me?

It never happened! Her "opinion" is, once again, wrong!

Anonymous said...

"Deborah...I gave you the benefit of the doubt when I said you were probably mistaken. Now you are alleging that we had a conversation in front of HQ about you posting on this blog?

That's not "mistaken"...that's pure fantasy!"

Maybe Mrs. Greene thinks you are someone else?

ITCM said...

Delusional?


...goes to get the popcorn.

Anonymous said...

Yep! Just what we need on our school board!

Deborah Greene said...

Did you guys ask for me to comment so you could bash me or did you want to know about the issues? I am way too busy to play games.

Reader said...

I have to say I do like to know the truth. If what Mrs. Greene says is true about school finances, I have no reason to question it. I am not one that goes along with everything to make a friend. That's what has happened. That's why we are in the shape we're in. Some of us have been told that we are racists and not tolorant of others enough, that some of us believe it. I'm tired of it. So yeah, I'm gonna vote for Romney...our nation means more to me than I realized. Obama's fans can vote to go forward. They play, Follow the Leader.

New Guy, you don't like what Debroah's said, I understand that. She's not the best in the world for the way she comes across. She has ticked me off many times, but it's the truth. I don't blame you for being upset about the post. If you didn't say it, you know it. The older I get, memory lapses happen frequently. Heck, just had one!

I personally want to know what's going on with my money...so if you can let her post every once in awhile, I would appreciate it. I like you, New Guy...we could be friends outside of the blog. Sark, you're still my favorite.

NewGuy said...

Reader, I Like You TOO !!!

Deborah Greene has not ever been restricted from posting here. I have no idea why she would make the claims she made about a conversation that never took place.

It is an indication however, of her credibility.

NewGuy said...

Deborah, I neither asked you to post nor have I bashed you.

I did point out that I didn't have any conversation with you about your posting or not posting on this blog. I have no idea why you would make such an obviously false statement.

I hardly think that's "bashing" but it does show your disdain for the truth.

Mike D. said...

Debbie "Taliban" Greene,

I am struck by the professionalism Dr. Kafitz demonstrated in his response to your demands. I do not know his political leanings, but he seems quite capable of dealing with your diatribe with class, dignity, and attention to detail through careful consideration.

I seriously doubt that you would have such class, given your propensity to deny realities that stare you in the face and your theocratic declaration that you would allow your religious beliefs to trump the law of the land (our Constitution) if given any ability to legislate.

Bash you? There is no need. You've revealed your dictatorial aspirations in virtually every conversation I have observed.

Reader said...

New Guy, I don't remember you asking her to stop, but like I say...memory lapse on her part maybe. Hey, I understand. When Johnny made her comments about me for no reason, I was taken aback and never thought I'd be attacked, much less be called a liberal.

People read things that aren't on paper sometimes...apparently Mrs. Greene did that with you and Johnny with me. Still, if you know her personally...you have a different opinion.

NewGuy said...

Reader, she isn't claiming it was a post that was made...she is saying that it was in a face to face conversation.

I have never had a conversation with her about this blog, her posting (or not posting) or anything that could be "mistaken" for that. It is either fantasy or fabrication on her part.

Either way....

guy faulkes said...

Guy, yes ...to some degree you are correct and that we might offer a strong opinion as fact. But, are you saying it was her OPINION that she had a conversation with me? - New Guy

No, I am saying that as far as I can remember no one but LPOV was asked to stop after he said he would if asked and Opoib was given a choice to stay on topic or be removed. They were both trolls that contributed nothing to a discussion.

Ms. Greene does not fit this category. She can be almost as abrasive as I can, but she certainly backs up her opinions with facts.

As far as my comment on opinions being stated as facts, we all do it. We all see the world as individuals. Therefore our world view is different from every one else.

I beleive this is called existentialism. The difference in me and most existentialists is that they seem to agonize over what others think. I recognize that others may think differently, but I do not care. If you want me to change my thinking, prove to me I should. (Ms. Greene is good at this.)

I believe most of the people that frequent this blog are the same as I am.

I have to wonder what headquarters Ms. Greene was speaking of. I did not know the blog had one. Am I not invited to the party?

I am willing to bet no statement saying she should leave the blog was ever made by New Guy. It may have been made by one of our more liberal members that could not tolerate disagreement, but not New Guy.

NewGuy said...

Thanks, Guy. I assure you I had no such conversation and have never made any statement to her that could even be misinterpreted as she said.

I assumed she meant the local Republican HQ, which opened only a month ago. If so, that would narrow down the time frame.

It isn't a huge issue, except that it does show that what she states as "facts" are often not factual at all.

Reader said...

New Guy, I believe you. I think she's so outspoken, that she doesn't realize the people she offends...yes, I'm thin-skinned. We all know what we say, if she made it up...that's on her shoulders. I'm not taking sides by any means. As much as she digs in the finances, she does bring a lot of truth out that's wanted to be kept hidden.

Just wondering why Mr. Kafitz would ask her if she had children in the system? That's an ignorant statement if I've ever heard one. I'd probably ask him how many teachers have children in the system and does he?

NewGuy said...

I don't feel that what she claimed I said is personally offensive to me. If she had told me she wasn't going to post, and if I had replied "good", I certainly wouldn't hide from that. What I found offensive is only that she either intentionally made a false statement (about a minor issue) or else is out of touch with reality.

I honestly don't know which.

I do know that she hasn't retracted her statement nor has she apologized for the falsehood.

Deborah Greene said...

New Guy, you don't want others to know your true identity and that is why you don't acknowledge the conversation. We had a conversation in front of headquarters when you informed me 1) that the Republican Party wasn't going to support me because I called the leadership of the Republican Party out, on the Watauga Conservative for not being more visible and involved 2) that the Republican Party, "even if they wanted to, could not support me because the State would pull the local charter" and 3) I was not to come to any of your functions because I was running against your candidates. In response to item 1 I told you that I hadn't been blogging on the Watauga Conservative and you said "good, stay off".

The two of, you and another person, also offended a Republican that was standing there by telling him that he was just as bullheaded as I was and you didn't know why you wasted your time with either of us. This was in response to pointing out to you that he agreed with 1) and disagreed with 2) because he was at one time on the executive committee of the Republican Party and candidate search committee.

Now, either you are interested in the issue at hand or not. You asked for a comment and you got it. Dr. Kafitz did not act appropriately when we first met because he was not aware that I was giving him facts. He has since made an about turn in his attitude and assured me that he is addressing the issues. I can only give him the benefit of the doubt until proven otherwise.

I strongly feel that the reason the questions have not been answered come from the board of education and not Dr. Kafitz. And, it I would also say, the answers could be admission of violation of law.

NewGuy said...

Deborah...You are either mistaken, fantasizing or lying. I can't tell which but you and I never had any such conversation.

It isn't really much of an issue. If I had said it, I would admit it. What is important is your inability to discern fact from fantasy.

And now you are saying:
"You asked for a comment and you got it."

Was this part of that same imaginary conversation you think we had when I supposedly didn't want you to post?



Deborah Greene said...

Somebody on this blog said:

Anonymous said...

I'd be interested to hear Deborah Greene's thoughts on this issue as well as what she would do should she be elected in November.
September 15, 2012 9:22 PM

Excuse me, whoever you are. This Blog doesn't want my comments. Responding to you is a "Fantasy". Good-bye. I have bigger fish to fry.

I don't have time for a group of Republican Party leaders that have succumbed to "Idolatry". Beware, this blog is used by the Republican Party leaders for their own benefit, not the benefit of the Republican Party as a whole- that includes New Guy. You should have already figured that out!

NewGuy said...

Deborah...

You said in your post addressed to me that I asked you to comment. Now it is "someone on this blog" that asked you. (anonymous).

Perhaps you were similarly confused about a conversation you may have had with someone "in front of HQ". It certainly wasn't me.

It does go to my point though that your 'facts' are often wrong.



Anonymous said...

Did anybody else look up "Idoltry"?


It's the worshiping of an object as if it were a diety.

Go figure.

Anonymous said...

deity!

guy faulkes said...

If anyone remembers, neither the Wolf or I are Republicans. We have argued with other posters on this blog many times about the direction of the Republican party, Romney being just like Obama, zoning in the ETJ, etc.

Our sometimes heated debates with the others on these issues makes the blog more interesting, in my opinion. Only the liberals have ever asked either of us to leave.

Ms. Greene can be very abrasive, (so could Rico and I)but she provides a large amount of information. Each of us will decide the validity of the information as we would with anyone's post.

For these reasons, I do not beleive New Guy said anything about wishing Ms. Greene would leave and I wish she would post again and frequently.

You have now head my two cents on this issue for the final time.

Mike D. said...

And just like that, the Theocrat, Deborah "Taliban" Greene, alienates more people who may have voted for her.

Don't worry, Debbie. I hear there are some camps in Yemen that are recruiting Americans who believe in rule by religious decree. Maybe they will vote for you.

ITCM said...

Yes, and hopefully those who were even possibly going to vote for her are reading her craziness on this blog.

guy faulkes said...

What makes you think I am not going to vote for her MikeD? Her argument about a comment with New Guy has nothing to do with the issues she has uncovered about the school system. What exactly does religion have to do with these issues?

I am interested in your calling someone names such as Deborah "Taliban" Greene. How is your doing that any different than what you decried about Rico? Is there not some kind of statement about pots and kettles.